kkholt Posted November 5, 2006 Share Posted November 5, 2006 Hi Rich, That's good news, dinner with Suting! Maybe it will feel right to talk about the grief you are both experiencing. Hope you have a great dinner, pick a quiet romatic place where you can have a private thoughtful conversation. -Karen --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- NOTE: Several posts were split from this topic to prevent a hi-jacking. If you're looking for them you'll find them in Stroke Survivor Support with the title of, "I Had Another Stroke-Like Episode." Please stay on topic as described in the title line of this thread. MBA: J.R. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robyn Posted November 7, 2006 Share Posted November 7, 2006 Hey Joe...been reading your posts here and there. My ex-partner (who had the stroke) broke up with me about a month-ish after her stroke. I'm still in shock as I had no indication there were relationship issues. So with respect to Suting, she is a lucky woman and I hope you two take it very slow to help her catch up to who you are now and what you need. She is willing to talk which is great. Speaking as someone who loved a stroke survivor, she needs to understand how you are feeling and what you are going through and what you need. Try, to the best of your abilities, to let her know what's going on for you...if she truly loves you as you've said I'm sure she will work with you to continue to build the relationship. My ex accused me of not caring about her needs but she wouldn't tell me her needs either...one can't have it both ways... Be forthcoming with her...its a risk but one worth taking if the relationship is to survive! As for the blogging, by all means begin! I resisted at first but once I got started it was very helpful. Don't worry about it being interesting. The blog is for YOU, not for the audience. We bloggers are supportive, no matter what you post or how coherent it may or may not be!! LOL!!! As for being conservative, follow the advice of the stroke survivors who have responded to you...they know what the experience will be like...If I were you, however, I'd head back to the emergency room, too! Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richman Posted November 8, 2006 Author Share Posted November 8, 2006 Robyn: Thanks for your comments. It is actually surprising to me that your partner, who suffered the stroke, was the one who severed the relationship (either way, I'm sure that it is painful). I don't know who lucky Suting is to be with me post-stroke, and it took a toll on her mentally and physically as well, but it took alot of character and her core goodness for her to not just quit and be willing to resume talking and seeing each other. When my stroke hit, I showed her my worst and darkest side, and, of course, it affected her and scared her, but she always tried to encourage me and show that she still cared about me, and convince me, that, even if there was some damage, that she would still view me as the same person. The main change, I think, is that our relationship is not her main priority now; she's focusing on preparing her sons for graduating from high school and college (they're both extremely bright, as to be expected, their mother has a Master's from Columbia Univ., I felt slightly intimidated even before my stroke!) We'll both take it slowly and rebuild the confidence, trust, and, hopefully, some happy moments again. Thanks for the vot eof confidence in my decision to get checked out again at the ER. I guess all stroke victims become hyper-sensitive to anything that resembles the initial "brain attack". Take care. -Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robyn Posted November 8, 2006 Share Posted November 8, 2006 Yeah...it was pretty surprising to me too. All the stories I've read were about the caregiver or spouse leaving, not the stroke survivor leaving. She had emotional intimacy issues before the stroke...and I realize now she had no idea how to be in an emotionally intimate committed relationship. I also think she has transferrence issues with her therapist whom she's used for some 15 long years, non stop. But that's another long long story... I'm sure if you had a few hours to read through my blog you'd get the gist of why I think she left!!! Her baggage, not mine! Anyway, it sounds to me like you guys really need to rebuild the trust you had between you. YOU need to believe that she loves you and that you are worth loving...sounds like you may have some doubts post-stroke. But I think if you work with a couples counselor, not YOUR therapist, but a counselor dedicated to helping your relationship, that should go a long way to helping heal the gap that has grown between you! I wish you a ton of luck...I wish my ex had been as willing to work on the relationship but she just called me one day and said, don't call, don't write, don't visit, don't contact my family...just leave me alone...I'm focusing on my family, not you. Even as I type it I'm still in shock how I went from her best friend, confidante, and partner to persona non grata in 30 days or less... Ah well...I'm moving on... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richman Posted November 8, 2006 Author Share Posted November 8, 2006 Robyn: I am so sorry to hear about your breakup. Back in April, before my stroke, my ex-fiance chose to abandon ship on, of all days, Easter Sunday (I know that must be symbolic, but the meaning and for whom I've never been able to figure out). She left the engagement ring on the nightstand, the housekey in a little green box on a bookshelf, cleaned out her clothese, with no note, no warning. The comedian Jim Belushi calls this "The Pearl Harbor Syndrome", the sneak attack abandonment by the party who's been rehearsing this in their mind for weeks, and getting support from a friend, a sister or brother, a relative, to psyche up to leave you mentally unprepared. My main fear is that in the long term, Suting will discover that I truly am a different, deficient person. I've got to stop reading info on the Internet about intellectual deficits and stroke. It scares the hell out of me, and makes me start to believe that the losses are much larger than what I've been told objectively by friends. Hang in there. -Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bstockman Posted November 8, 2006 Share Posted November 8, 2006 Joe, I understand... I also feel my deficits... most people that I meet cannot tell I had a stroke. I do have cognitive issues ... but I think I feel them more than they actually show to many people. I have enough cognitive issues that I cannot return to work. I have days that are better than others, and some days I have some speech/word retrieval issues. Some days I can do math and others have a hard time even with an adding machine...lol ( I am now dyslexic, since the stroke). Really and truly try not to compare yourself to how you were before the stroke happened. You may have some cognitive issues, but I am sure they are really much more noticible to you than to others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwatrous Posted November 8, 2006 Share Posted November 8, 2006 If its meant to be, she will contact you - I would just let it go, and wait for her June Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robyn Posted November 8, 2006 Share Posted November 8, 2006 Joe...I agree...sometimes too much information can hurt you! But I think you have your own work to do, dealing with why your ex-fiancee left you and perhaps how those feelings are affecting your relationship with Suting. It feels to me in reading your post like its all wrapped up together somehow and then having the stroke in the midst of that is not helping you. Of course, I'm not a therapist (nor do I play one on TV!) but having gone the therapy route on and off for the last 5 years I've tried to learn a few things from my experiences!!! Try to tease all of those issues apart, if possible...working with a good therapist, if you are willing and able to do so will be an enormous help and enable you to accept the love and relationship Suting wants to offer you and you want to offer her. I have found you gotta clear the old baggage out before you can move on to the new. The universe is kind of crazy...it knows the lessons we need to learn and it puts us through those lessons TIME AND TIME AGAIN until we learn it and internalize it. I've had to learn that the last couple of months...the crap kept coming to bite me in the butt until I finally confronted it and defused it and learned the lesson I needed to learn. If you ever want to chat, off-line, just PM me! Robyn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hostmel Posted November 8, 2006 Share Posted November 8, 2006 Joe - glad to see you venting - constructive anger is good and helps along the healing process - Acceptance takes a long time and hurts a LOT in the process, I do hope you take a quiet moment to visit the links I posted for you before. You have quite a bit in your life right now that is making you extremely angry, sad, scared and maybe a little confused right now. You are grieving, whether you admit it or not, for the side of you and the life you had. Nothing will ever be the same, sorry to be blunt, but it appears from your posts that you do respond better to bluntness. You sound like you are sstill a very strong man, and not to take you to task, but I can only imagine the words and sentiments you might have expressed here prior to your stroke. The board is here for venting and for asking and receiving advice. I do not mean to offend but the following is something I don't think you've really heard yet. The you that you were before is gone, some parts are still there but those parts belong to the new you. If there is someone in your life that can't/won't accept the new you, then life is probably better without them as they only get in the way. I've finally quit wakiing up thinking that it didn't really happen and it was all a bad dream - since then, I've found a peace that eluded me for the first six months after my stroke. I agree with Robyn that counseling may be a very good thing for you. It sounds like there may be some other things in life that remain unresolved for youthat the stroke laid glaringly bare for you. Not to talk you out of anything, feelings, lawsuits, or otherwise, but I do remember someone saying that "Decisions made in haste may only go to waste" Apologies for misquoting if I have and for not knowing who said it.... Who am I to say these words to you? No one but a felllow survivor who remembers thae anger , pain and sadness that I let get hold of me and whip me up into a bit of a frenzy. I'd like my experience to help spare you from climbing all of those heights - the fall is something to be missed, my friend. I wish you the best and also echo Robyn's advice to start a blog Sending prayers for peace, acceptance, and wisdom your way.............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwatrous Posted November 8, 2006 Share Posted November 8, 2006 Sometimes, words that have been said cannot be taken back or repaired - The stroke is not her fault, so please have faith that no permanent damage has been done June Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richman Posted November 9, 2006 Author Share Posted November 9, 2006 Mel, Robyn, June: I've really taken inside what all of you had said to me, and I will continue to re-read your posts. In terms of karmic lessons, I would say that the main event that connects both of these women (my ex-fiance and Suting) is that, in both cases, I suffered a stroke, however "minor" the damage cited by the doctors, almost immediately after having sex with them. I know, please don't laugh, and I know it sound bizarre and far-fetched, but it's true. And I guess, subconciously, I wanted to please them so much that I actually damaged myself physically in the process. Now, that I'm permanently damaged, they no longer need or want me. So, the only lesson that I culled from this so far is, don't try too hard to please someone else, especially sexually!! But, a stroke, that seems like too severe a lesson!!! Mel, the words "the you that you were is gone" is so true, I feel it to the core of my being, and it causes a pain that Suting, my ex-fiance, or noone except those of you who have lived through it would understand. It seems too high a price to pay for the type of conventional relationship that most of my friends were able to have without paying for it with permanent brain damage! Sorry, I'm feeling really awful about my losses right now. And tonight, even though it was a pleasant evening, Suting admitted that the spark is gone. I'm sure she did her best to kill it. And, of course, she couldn't refuse a free meal! (I know, that's an awful thing to say). :head_hurts: -Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bstockman Posted November 9, 2006 Share Posted November 9, 2006 Awww, Joe I am truly sorry the spark is gone... and the relationship ended. It is a difficult road to acceptance. As other's have said maybe some counseling to help. As Robyn said until we understand the baggage we are carrying and dump it in the trash bin, another relationship would probably have that bagge along with it. Take time to grieve for whay you have lost.. and to grieve for the relationship. Take time to get to know and like the "new" you. When you are ready ... to have another relationship the person you meet will know you as you are. After my divorce.. 16 yrs ago I went to a counselor... actually I went to one and thought he was an "idiot".... I found one I could talk to and be comfortable with. I had a friend going to Adult children of Alcholics meetings and went to some with her. We also went to some Co-Depent mettings. I will say I was extremely sceptical of these... Well I learned a lot about myself and my relationships.... I am happily married now. We have been together for 15 years and will celebrate our 10th Wedding annniversary this Dec. Sometimes we need a little "help" finding the reasons we pick certain relationships .. and find our "inner selves" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richman Posted November 9, 2006 Author Share Posted November 9, 2006 Bonnie: All I can say is that, this is a nightmare. :head_hurts: When I told her last night that I'd missed her, her response was: nothing. Silence. I don't know if the relationship with Suting has ended, but all indications are is that it will never be the same again. I am angry with her, at times, because I suffered a stroke after having sex with her. Otherwise, it might never have happened. She will be able to walk away from this, dust herself off, and meet someone else, as if we'd never met. I'm left with permanent brain damage from a stroke after being physically involved with her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richman Posted November 9, 2006 Author Share Posted November 9, 2006 Bonnie: I could never like the "new" me. I'd just gotten to tolerate the "old" me. I could have easily been content with the "old me", accepted my limited life with a woman with Suting who also accepted me, BUT NO!!!! Thanks alot, God!!!! :Tantrum: And the only conclusion I've reached after 51 years of this is that the longer I live, the more I stand to lose. It's always like trying to light a fire with wet logs, or trying to build a house on quicksand. Or, in other words, there's always alittle bit more to lose the next round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robyn Posted November 9, 2006 Share Posted November 9, 2006 Joe...I'm so sorry...I have lots to add here but NO TIME this morning. I WILL return to respond. YOU ARE COMPLETELY DESERVING OF LOVE...but FIRST YOU HAVE TO LOVE YOURSELF!!! I know...been there done that so I'm coming from a similar place!! There is beauty and love out there for you, I promise! I'll be back...more to add!!!!! :hug: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jriva Posted November 9, 2006 Share Posted November 9, 2006 In terms of karmic lessons, I would say that the main event that connects both of these women (my ex-fiance and Suting) is that, in both cases, I suffered a stroke, however "minor" the damage cited by the doctors, almost immediately after having sex with them. I know, please don't laugh, and I know it sound bizarre and far-fetched, but it's true. And I guess, subconciously, I wanted to please them so much that I actually damaged myself physically in the process. I am angry with her, at times, because I suffered a stroke after having sex with her. Otherwise, it might never have happened. Joe, Did you, by chance, at any point throw this theory in the faces of these two women? I know if a man had tried to lay that guilt trip on me I would have run in the other direction, too. 1) Common sense and medical expertise tells you that it simply isn't true---strokes aren't caused by having sex any more than mowing the lawn causes guys to have heart attacks. It's totally unfair to blame someone for what happened to you. 2) These two woman may have already unfairly blamed themselves and you having voice those words to confirm it in their heads would cause a guilt trip that would be almost impossible to overcome. 3) It would make any future love making extremely difficult when you're the person who was blamed for causing a stroke and all the repercussion that happened afterwards. I don't believe a relationship that is only three months old is likely to survive this kind of guilt trip, especially when you say that your doctors won't confirm that you even had a stroke. The ineptitude of various "specialists" who see the markings on the MRI and the residual symptoms, but won't officially label it "a stroke", always with the CYA disclaimer, "well, you know, medicine is not an exact science", has more of an effect on Suting than me... Since you had your CVA's after having sex has anyone suggested that you see a heart doctor for a stress test? Jean Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hostmel Posted November 9, 2006 Share Posted November 9, 2006 Mel, the words "the you that you were is gone" is so true, I feel it to the core of my being, and it causes a pain that Suting, my ex-fiance, or noone except those of you who have lived through it would understand. It seems too high a price to pay for the type of conventional relationship that most of my friends were able to have without paying for it with permanent brain damage! Sorry, I'm feeling really awful about my losses right now. And tonight, even though it was a pleasant evening, Suting admitted that the spark is gone. I'm sure she did her best to kill it. And, of course, she couldn't refuse a free meal! (I know, that's an awful thing to say). :head_hurts: Joe - please don't apologize for what you are feeling - as I said, I've ben there too - and on bad days I stilll go there. It does just $%&$&%$& make me mad that somefriends and loved ones drop you like a hot potato because you can no longer be who they want you to be and they don't want to accept the new person. I'm still at odds with a former NURSE friend of mine about this - yea, she's a nurse and I still get crap from her.. I do most certainly feel your pain and I hope I have not contributed to it - if I have, you have my most sincere apology.........it's hard Joe, very hard. I still would really urge you to get some professional help - counseling and talking it out "in person" can help a lot along with chatting with us here on the board. I so wish I could give you a big hug - hope today is better than yesterday.....it does get better with time - :hug: :hug: :hug: :hug: you can PM or email me at any time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robyn Posted November 10, 2006 Share Posted November 10, 2006 I PMed you buddy...hang in there. THe first step is taking care of yourself... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dstraugh Posted November 10, 2006 Share Posted November 10, 2006 Joe, I'm sorry for what you are dealing with with Suting. The spark may be gone from the relationship, no matter what the reason(s). What is important at this point is the fact that you SURVIVED. I know, you're probably saying "Big Whoop"; but you are not yet in acceptance of what transpired with you - even the docs cannot concur there. But, it appears you did have a stroke, possibly more than one. Accepting is part of the healing process. Fortunately, in my case, I was not married or in a relationship when I had my stroke. I had been engaged previously; he ended the relationship a year prior to my stroke when I was the recipient of a total hysterectomy - JERK!!!!!. Sent me a blasted e-mail to boot to break off our engagement. Anyway..........I know he woulda left me after the stroke - heck I've wanted to leave myself!!! I'm quickly approaching the 2 year mark - in the last few months I have finally accepted what happened to me. I realize too that I will probably not recover 100% - but there can still be a miracle :big_grin: This doesn't mean you should worry about one more thing.....you have alot going on right now!! But keep in mind, you don't want anything else to happen to you. Just hang in there - check into some counseling for yourself. Liking yourself may very well help your recovery! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richman Posted November 10, 2006 Author Share Posted November 10, 2006 Dear onesideme: Breaking off an engagement via e-mail?!!! What a f***ing creep!!! Yes, survived, you're right, BIG WHOOP!!! Now I have to take off for my job that I can no longer do, and await the next catastrophe. :blush: -Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hostmel Posted November 10, 2006 Share Posted November 10, 2006 Joe - You are here for a reason, hon - you did survive the major event and you will survive the fallout - you are strong of will and life-force. We are not professional counselors here, but we love having you with us :blush: and I will again encourage you to seek some professional counsel. Thanks for your PM yesterday and my reply still holds true, venting is a required part of the process and you can always PM me - Take good care and come back -please feel free to come into one of the chats, we can go into a private chat if you need to..... Sending hugs - :hug: :hug: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dstraugh Posted November 11, 2006 Share Posted November 11, 2006 Joe, I really really think you should pursue counseling. Your recovery may very well be affected by your mental state you're in right now - you dislike yourself and you're waiting foir the next thing to go wrong. We're all concerned about you. Hugs to you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robyn Posted November 14, 2006 Share Posted November 14, 2006 Absolutely...we're not trying to nag...we know this can help you though and we are all here to support you no matter what!!! You've got a lot of stuff to cope with and without a familial support network it will be that much more tough!!! Let us be your family! :hug: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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